Key Takeaways
- Administrative fellowships serve as a critical pipeline, bridging the gap between academic theory and high-level healthcare operations and strategy.
- Structured internships are vital for talent development, providing the measurable project experience necessary for candidates to succeed in competitive interviews.
- Implementing a dual-mentorship model, pairing fellows with both preceptors and executive sponsors, maximizes executive exposure and accelerates professional growth.
- A supportive organizational culture with open communication is essential for retaining fellows and fostering long-term leadership capacity.
One of the most rewarding paths for early-career healthcare administrators is the pursuit of an administrative fellowship. These fellowships serve as a bridge between academic training and hands-on leadership, offering immersive experiences in operations, finance, strategy, and patient-centered care. In a recent podcast conversation, hosted by The Fellowship Review through the American Journal of Healthcare Strategy, interviewer Vrushangi Shah connected with Cincinnati Children's Hospital Medical Center (CCHMC) Fellow Abhishek Gurnani, MHAto learn more about his path.
The discussion delved into why he chose a hospital administrative fellowship, how he navigated a competitive fellowship application cycle, and what life is like at Cincinnati Children's.
From Texas to Ohio: Abhishek's Background and Pivot to Healthcare
"I was born and raised in a small border town called Laredo, Texas. I graduated from Texas A&M University with a degree in business management back in 2019."
After graduating, he explored different career paths in business before deciding to return to Laredo and "dip his feet" into healthcare for the first time. His experience sparked an interest in the broader complexities of health administration, ultimately leading him back to Texas A&M University to pursue a Master of Health Administration (MHA) and consider MHA fellowship opportunities. This decision to enroll in one of the many master's degree programs available in healthcare administration marked a significant turning point in his career.
"Coming into a student as an MHA, I had a lot of imposter syndrome because I felt like my peers had already that public health and healthcare administration experience that I lacked"
Abhishek recalls, highlighting a feeling many students experience. Pivoting from business management to healthcare leadership can seem daunting, but with determination and strong mentorship in healthcare, he found his footing.
The Internship at Houston Methodist: A Catalyst for Growth
Internships often serve as a springboard to administrative fellowship jobs. Abhishek credits his summer at Houston Methodist (Which AJHCS ranks as the #1 institution for emerging leaders) as a pivotal time for developing crucial healthcare administration skills:
"I was really lucky to have friends in the second years that were going through the administrative fellowship cycle, and I got to hear a little bit about it from them. It sounded like a really cool experience… and I was lucky enough that my program director really spoke highly about administrative fellowships."
Houston Methodist stood out to Abhishek for its strong reputation and opportunities in ambulatory operations, quality, process improvement, and even finance. He and two peers from Texas A&M tackled a range of projects, concluding with a case study that projected the evolution of ambulatory operations at the institution.
Yet the most critical takeaway for him was that an internship is more than a degree requirement—it is a key talking point and learning experience that carries into fellowship interviews.
"I definitely utilized a lot of the experience in the talking points in all my interviews, so I was thankful to have a great internship experience,"
Deciding on a Fellowship: Mentorship and Open Minds
Abhishek admits that when he first heard about fellowships, he had little knowledge of what they truly entailed. Initially, he planned to focus on a "traditional job route" after his MHA. However, the guidance of professors and mentors—especially his program director, Mr. Jack Buckley —convinced him to explore healthcare administrative fellowships:
"I was lucky enough that I knew the right people, and I was lucky enough that my program director… spoke highly about it."
For him, the biggest draw was the breadth of experience. A year of executive-level exposure, tackling high-impact projects, and the mentorship found within a fellowship is unparalleled for early career professionals. When interview season rolled in, Abhishek cast a wide net, applying to 12 to 15 programs—most in Texas, but also across the nation. His openness led him far from the Lone Star State:
"I was in the mindset that maybe I would just apply to Houston Methodist, Texas Children's, UT Southwestern… but having that open mind, I ended up at Cincinnati Children's."
The Application Cycle: Tips for Success
Abhishek admits that "the application cycle was pretty stressful." Nevertheless, he navigated it by:
- Starting Early: Procrastination can be your worst enemy. He submitted his administrative fellowship application as soon as applications opened, gathering letters of recommendation and ensuring no deadlines were missed. Understanding the fellowship timeline is crucial for success.
- Open-Mindedness: "I think the main tips and tricks are to really keep an open mind and not to limit yourself." Even if there's a geographical area you prefer, applying to programs nationwide can open doors you never considered.
- Building a Healthy Funnel: He applied to over a dozen fellowships, balancing well-known Texas programs with institutions in other states—like the Cincinnati Children's fellowship. A broader approach increases the likelihood of an offer.
- Leveraging the Internship: Abhishek reiterates how vital it was to have strong talking points from his Houston Methodist internship. Being able to speak to measurable achievements and tangible growth added weight to his interviews.
- Staying Calm in Interviews: "Don't put too much pressure on yourself… Once the interviews come along, just be a little bit more free. That's where I ended up doing a lot better."
It's common for candidates to overthink questions, especially in the high-stakes environment of fellowship interviews. Abhishek emphasizes that a relaxed, prepared approach goes a long way in securing administrative fellow positions. He also stresses the importance of a well-crafted personal statement that highlights your unique experiences and motivations.
For those interested in applying, it's essential to check the eligibility requirements for each program and follow the application instructions carefully. Some programs may use the National Administrative Fellowship Centralized Application Service (NAFCAS) to streamline the application process.
Life as a Fellow at Cincinnati Children's
"I am blessed with two amazing co-fellows… We have a great support system."
Upon arriving at Cincinnati Children's Hospital Medical Center, Abhishek discovered a well-organized administrative fellowship program that gave him immediate responsibility. The one-year, project-based fellowship at CCHMC pairs each fellow with both a preceptor and an executive sponsor:
- Preceptor: Abhishek's main mentor, Dave Mayhaus, is the Vice President of Allied Health. They meet once a week, ensuring a steady flow of communication. For Abhishek, Dave's 40 years of experience at Cincinnati Children's have been indispensable.
- Executive Sponsor: In Abhishek's case, Stephanie Ebken, Chief of Staff and Chief Marketing and Communication Officer, meets with him monthly. She uses her C-suite vantage point to support Abhishek's professional development and facilitate his connections within the organization.
Working side by side with senior leaders, Abhishek is already gaining exposure to how decisions are made at the highest levels of pediatric healthcare administration. While each fellow primarily has individual projects, they collaborate on larger efforts—particularly the fellowship recruitment cycle—and hope to tackle a group project before completing the program.
The fellowship experience also includes observational learning experiences, allowing fellows to shadow various departments and gain insights into family-centered care practices, a cornerstone of pediatric healthcare.
Mentorship and Culture
A hallmark of many top-tier fellowships is the strong mentorship culture. The Cincinnati Children's Administrative Fellowship is no exception:
"I remember at the beginning of the fellowship… I was able to call my preceptor after hours, and he picked up right away. …He's just been there for me through thick and thin."
Beyond support from his preceptor and executive sponsor, Abhishek values the broader hospital culture. Whether navigating a conflict or exploring a new project area, experienced administrators at Cincinnati Children's are ready to help. This open-door mindset fosters a sense of belonging and accelerates learning, providing invaluable networking opportunities in healthcare leadership.
The hospital also emphasizes diversity in healthcare through various initiatives and employee resource groups, which contribute to a more inclusive work environment and enhance cultural competence among staff.
Moving to Cincinnati: Discovering the Midwest
Relocating can be one of the most intimidating aspects of a fellowship—especially if it's across state lines. For Abhishek, the transition from Texas to Ohio introduced him to a vibrant, welcoming city. Though the initial drive and the first couple of weeks required adjustment, the city quickly won him over
"The people here are extremely welcoming. The city isn't too big, but it has everything a big city offers: major sports teams, events like Blink and Oktoberfest, and an amazing zoo."
He admits that starting "from scratch" with no established support system was challenging, but the camaraderie of hospital colleagues and the charm of Cincinnati helped him feel at home in this new pediatric institution.
Advice to Aspiring Fellows
When asked to share final thoughts, Abhishek offers simple yet powerful guidance:
"I would say the main thing would be don't put too much pressure on yourself. Everything will play out the way it's supposed to be, as long as you put your best foot forward and just know that you put in your best effort into those applications."
He stresses the importance of doing well in your graduate internship, building relationships with potential mentors or recommenders, and harnessing the support offered by faculty. Over-preparation can breed anxiety in interviews, so a calmer, genuine approach often resonates better with interviewers.
Moreover, Abhishek's story highlights that an administrative fellowship is not limited to those with solely healthcare-focused backgrounds. His pivot from business management to health administration underscores that curiosity, dedication, and a willingness to learn can open doors across the healthcare spectrum.
Aspiring fellows should also focus on developing their cultural competence, as this is increasingly important in healthcare leadership roles. Understanding and addressing healthcare equity issues can set candidates apart in the application process.
Closing Thoughts
Abhishek's journey demonstrates the transformative power of fellowships, especially when combined with supportive mentors and a willingness to embrace new environments. His Houston Methodist internship primed him for fellowship success, while open-mindedness led him to a role at one of the nation's most renowned children's hospitals. At Cincinnati Children's, he is immersed in real-world challenges and guided by leaders passionate about developing future executives.
His final words resonate for every prospective applicant: trust the process, start early, leverage your internship experiences, and stay open to unexpected pathways. For those contemplating an administrative fellowship—whether at Cincinnati Children's, in your home state, or across the country—Abhishek's narrative offers a clear message: with sincere effort, practical experience, and a dash of adventure, you can find a path that not only accelerates your career but also shapes you into the healthcare leader you aspire to be.
The Cincinnati Children's Administrative Fellowship provides a unique opportunity for project-based experience in pediatric healthcare administration, offering a springboard for career advancement in the dynamic field of healthcare management. For those looking to make a significant impact in children's health and hospital administration, this fellowship stands out as an excellent launchpad for a rewarding career. Whether you're considering a role as an administrative resident or exploring various healthcare administrative fellowship opportunities, programs like the one at Cincinnati Children's offer invaluable experience in addressing healthcare equity issues and developing the skills necessary for success in this critical field.
<p>I would say the main thing would be don't put too much pressure on yourself I think um everything will play out the way it's supposed to be as long as you put your best foot forward and just know that you put in your best effort into those [Music] applications good evening everyone it's fangi sha with the fellowship review through the American Journal of healthcare strategy today I am thrilled to be joined by abishek gani abishek thank you for joining me today thank you for having me brangi yeah so let's just kick it right into the episode why don't you tell our listeners a little bit about where you're from where you went to school and where you are right now yeah so I was born and raised in a small border town called Laredo Texas um I graduated from Texas A&M Unity University with a degree in business management uh back in 2019 uh bounced around a couple of jobs until making my way back to Laredo to dip my feet into healthc care for the first time and decided to go back to Texas A&M to pursue the Masters in health administration uh which I just graduated from with in this may so that's a little bit about myself where I'm from and my schooling proud to be uh Aggie for both uh grad school and for my undergrad study so yeah that's incredible and thank you for sharing always good for me to highlight people from all around the country um and so you did your mha and you know one of the large parts of doing an mha and or any graduate degree in our field is doing some sort of an internship or some sort of um clinical experience and you had both so you were a clinical assistant but you also did an internship at Houston Methodist so can you tell our listeners about why you chose Houston Methodist and specifically for that internship what was your experience like yeah so Houston Methodist um as you probably know has a very well reputation um not only in Texas but throughout the nation and I think our mha program um our program director Mr Buckley and Mr Robinson they do a great job each year of really bringing in a lot of different programs throughout Texas that offer summer internships as like a career fair but it's specifically for mha students only so it was there where I met my two preceptors savier Escobar and Rosa Torres and they were the first people that I interviewed with and Houston Methodist actually was at the top of my list um our program director sent out the list of hospitals and organizations that would be attending um the day before and Houston Methodist you know just stuck out to me immediately um this internship was really geared towards ambulatory spe specifically so I didn't really get the inpatient side of it but it was really cool to take tackle that internship along with two of my fellow uh peers from my co from my mha cohort at A&M so yeah it was just a great experience I had a lot of different projects in operations and quality and process Improvement um one in finance as well and one getting to do a case study with my two uh fellow interns kind of looking at the now how the ambulator operations and finance looks like that Houston Methodist and what we can expect it to evolve uh in the near future so overall a really great experience and I would recommend that internship to anyone that is currently an mha student so yeah I love to hear that um and it does sound like an incredible experience at a very well-known and reputable um you know health system and so you know you're in grad school of course you're done with your internship close to graduation um there's a lot of options for you postgrad right you could go Consulting you could go get a traditional job but you chose to do a fellowship so tell our listeners about first of all how did you hear about the administrative Fellowship option and then what really kind of motivated you to pick that over the other options that you would have yeah so um I was originally a business major um so coming into a student as an mha I had a lot of impostor syndrome actually because I felt like my peers had already that public health and healthcare administration experience that I lacked um and to be completely honest when I started the mha program I had no idea what an administrative Fellowship was uh but I knew it sounded cool and I knew that it would probably open up a lot of cool doors for me in the near future um and I was lucky enough uh my program director Mr Buckley he really pushed the idea of administrative fellowships to us as soon as he as soon as we started the program pretty much from the first day uh we had a seminar class with him once a week and he always talked about the benefits of an administrative Fellowship so as time went on and hearing a little bit more from the second years when I was a first year on what their application Cycles looked like and what they're doing um I was lucky enough to have friends in the second years that were going through the administrative Fellowship cycle and I got to hear a little bit about it to them uh from them sorry and yeah it just sounded like a really cool experience and I was really lucky that I knew the right people and I was lucky enough that my program director uh really spoke highly about it uh about administrative fellowships in general um I think it really took a little bit of time for me to open up to it because like I said Healthcare was a completely new field to me and it still really is it's really ever evolving with the changing landscape so I'm always learning on a day-to-day basis but but having had you know professional work experience before coming into the mha program I always thought that no you know I'll go for a full-time job but really learning more and more over time about the benefits and seeing the people that had graduated from my mha program years before and where they are where they have gotten to now in their careers um it really made me take that leap of faith so that's a little bit of the reasoning why I decided to go for an administrative Fellowship rather than like the traditional job rout yeah absolutely thank you for giving that background um similar to you uh you know I had a professor that told me to look into administrative fellowships and really why I bring this up is really to highlight to graduate students to utilize their professors and their mentors at their you know graduate programs um you know they have a lot of knowledge and if a fellowship is something that you're interested in why not ask the people that know you best um at that point in your life to um explore the idea of fellow ship so thank you for highlighting that um kind of getting into the details now of your fellowship cycle so you come to the decision that you're going to do a fellowship you know um what was the application cycle for you like um you know if you're comfortable sharing just how many places you apply to um interviews that you may have received but overall can you just share with our listeners you know some lessons that you learned as you were applying to the fellowship cycle and like tips and tricks maybe for getting interviews yeah for sure um to be completely honest with you the application cycle was pretty stressful um I remember applying for the applications pretty much as soon as they opened up while I was doing my summer internship at Houston Methodist uh because the last thing that I wanted to do was wait until the last minute especially into with those uh recommendation letters um because the last thing I wanted to do was to submit those applications last minute and kind of uh ruin my my chances of uh you know acquiring an administrative Fellowship so really the mindset that I had was and this was also me kind of getting more of an open mind but I really wanted to stay in Texas that's where my family is that's where my friends are that's where my significant other is but my program director again really pushed the idea of being open-minded and he was the one who directly spoke to me about Cincinnati Children's and to really have an open mind um when applying to fellowships um you know not just staying in Texas but having an open mind of applying Nationwide so I did my research on a few organizations that really stuck out to me Nationwide of course Cincinnati Children's being one of them but I picked like five or six and in my mind I was like you know what I'm just going to do this to make my program director happy for the meantime uh because he really really was a great asset to me uh but the more I kept doing research the more I kept following falling in love with these organizations and when it came time to make my decision it was the fact that Cincinnati Children's was at the top of my list uh but I think the main tips and tricks that I would give to anyone that is kind of going to that through that cycle is to really keep an open mind and not to limit yourself um you know I was in the mindset that maybe I might just apply for like four or five um especially with those that i' really heard about being from Texas the most popular ones which are amazing in their own right as of course houon Methodist Texas Children's UT Southwestern uh which I did apply for but you know sometimes things just don't work out in your own way uh or how you want them to go so really applying to a healthy funnel and really having an open mind of you know taking that leap of faith and going somewhere where you might not have imagined yourself is is um something that I would definitely recommend and I really thank my program director for that um another thing that I recommend is applying to a good amount like I applied to maybe about I don't know the exact number but from 12 to 15 I applied most of them being in Texas with about four or five being um out of out of Texas and I really felt like that really um you know increase my chances because as you know being a former administrative fellow they're they're very competitive um so yeah I think that just would increase anyone's chances um and the last tip that I would give is uh start way before time um it's easy to take those applications for granted especially with most students you know doing a summer internship at the same time so really reach out to the references that you plan on asking and making them aware of what you would like to have in your recommendation letter that could make you stick out and making those key Connections in that first year with professors faculty and um you know people that you may be working closely with are Alles some things that I would recommend yeah absolutely what great advice um lot of advice that I've also given so I appreciate you highlighting that and you know I think the funny thing I'll kind of point out is um as you were answering I was smiling because you said you applied to mostly places in Texas and you landed in Ohio um so I think that what I'd like to point out in that scenario is yeah the fellowship cycle is absolutely competitive so exactly what you said keeping an open mind could you know make you land in a place that you never thought you were going to go to um but it it does end up working out in the end so I appreciate you highlighting that um you know and so of course Cincinnati great place to be um the Children's Hospital is is very well known and reputable and has so many accolades for people who are not familiar with the fellowship itself could you maybe highlight um is your fellowship one year is it twoe um is it Project based rotation based and then you know the most popular question do you have co-fellows or are you doing the fellowship by yourself yeah um so the fellowship is one year it is a Project based fellowship and I do have to commend my uh my program directors rosn Robinson and and Bobby Rodriguez for really getting us started with those projects you know at the day we started I entered Cincinnati Children's and they immediately had the project lined out for us which I think is uh really an amazing opportunity because as you know there's there's a big learning curve when you start for any fellow we're not going to know it all and the amount of things that I learn every day it's like drinking out of a fire hose and I'm I'm still four months in but it's still feels like I started yesterday so um and I think they did a great job with it being a Project based Fellowship of really giving me a taste of different different projects in different areas uh my preceptor is uh Dave May house who's the vice president of Allied Health and I just recently added on a project in the Allied Health Department um so yeah my projects are from wide variety of different areas and I think that's one of the you know a real key advantage of being a fellow and getting to dip your toes into these different areas because it really will allow you to see what I'm most interested in when I'm applying for full-time jobs and to answer your uh last question yes I am uh blessed with two amazing co-fellows and Emer and Robert Pierce um they are a great support system and they're amazing in their own right they're they're doing a great job at Cincinnati Children's right now they uh are really making a name for themselves and I'm really lucky to share this experience with them because um you know I've learned so much from them already in these short four months so I'm extremely grateful to have shared this experience with them and yeah they're doing amazing work themselves yeah it sure sounds like it and I know you're early on in your fellowship but you know the one thing I'll highlight is even in for months you experience so much health care and so much as an administrator um the reason I like to ask about the co- fellow question is really just because being a fellow um can sometimes be an isolating experience especially if there's only one of you because it is such a unique opportunity um so I love it when people highlight that they have co-fellows and someone to kind of share the experience with um to take it a step further now that I know that you have co-fellows um in the Cincinnati Children's administrative Fellowship do fellows have the opportunity to do joint projects together or do you feel the fellowship is more so individual in the projects that you three participate in yeah so I would say the project that we've really taken on together which I think is really shared throughout different fellowships um throughout the nation is of course the recruiting cycle um I think we learned a lot about each other with our different communication Styles and project management styles and so on and so forth but as of right now our projects are pretty individual based um I have heard from previous fellows at Cincinnati Children's that they they did have the opportunity to do some projects with one another so I'm really hoping that I do get to work with an and rodri in the near um eight months of our fellowship um on really working on a a project together that interests us so that is something maybe that we'll take up with our individual preceptors and see if they have something in store for us because um at a large organization like Cincinnati Children there's just always so much going on so I'm sure they have something um in the back of their minds that they could have all three of us tackle because it'd be great working with them for sure yeah absolutely and large Health Systems um one one thing is there's always something going on so I'm sure they could use the help and three Minds is better than one um and so you know one thing you touched on was preceptors so building upon that um I know you're early on in your fellowship but what's mentorship really like um in the short time that you've been there um have you been able to establish mentors for yourself within the health system and and do you feel like you know there's an open door policy and you can establish mentors in various Departments of the hospital yes uh mentorship has been I think the most important thing in this Fellowship for me um I've been blessed with an extremely amazing preceptor Dave May house who I mentioned uh we meet every every Friday so once a week and that is just to give a rundown on my projects how things are going anything that I may need his help with or any assistance with um and he he's just been there for me I remember at the beginning of the fellowship like in the first one or two months um there was a little bit of anxiety on my end because for one project specifically I was not able to make the meetings every week uh because there was always something going on Fellowship related where it just always had to coincide with that specific project and the last thing I wanted for the project leads and the project managers of that project to feel was that I was as a new fellow just skipping that projects even though I would warn uh warn them beforehand but calling being able to have that relationship with my preceptor and call him after hours and know that he's going to be there for me just because he's a seasoned veteran at Cincinnati Children he's been there for 40 years he knows the culture um even though it's a very laid-back and open-minded culture at Cincinnati childrens's there's still some things that you know any employee should avoid so he just when I called him he told me the best way to navigate this situation and I did just that and I was immediately able to you know alleviate my anxiety from there so it's definitely an open door policy we always run into each other in the hallways and yeah he's an amazing preceptor and he he's just been there for me through thick and thin throughout this fellowship and I can tell that he does not just care for me professionally but on a personal level as well and um I will add to that my executive sponsor is um Stephanie epin all the three fellows are have their own individual preceptors and their executive sponsors so mine is uh Miss Stephanie edkin who's the chief of staff and the chief marketing and communication officer um at Cincinnati Children's and you know being that sea level executive she has a wide variety of different connections throughout the hospital and uh immediately when I joined she immediately put calendar uh she immediately put time on my calendar once a month which uh immediately meant a lot to me because I can just imagine how busy your schedule uh is but we meet once a month just uh similar to my meetings with my preceptor just give a rundown of my projects and just make sure she just makes sure they're going smoothly for me um and yeah mentorship has been nothing but amazing yeah yeah that that's incredible and you know the reason I asked the mentorship question is because a lot of people do fellowships to get very seasoned mentors early on in their career so I love to hear that you have various mentors and access to them and you know one thing I'll highlight for our listeners also is um especially on the sea level people are incredibly busy but the fact that at so many hospitals across the country and Cincinnati Children's is no exception there is this desire for senior leaders to give back to fellows is very telling of where the organization stands in developing early careerists like myself and and also like you um so thank you for sharing that and you know I think one of the things that isn't talked about a ton in the fellowship cycle is the fact that you may have grown up in a part of the country you may go to grad school in that same part of the country but for a fellowship you may have to move thousands of miles to a completely new city New State um so for our listeners that are interested in Cincinnati Children's you know share what that move was like um you know being someone that was born seems like born and raised in Texas um what was kind of that shift like for you but also what do you like about living in Cincinnati um in Ohio yeah um the move to Cincinnati has been great so far I won't lie the live the drive to Cincinnati was uh pretty pretty long it was took about a day or so but I was glad that I was able to break that trip into into a couple of days but the city is amazing the people are extremely welcoming um the city is extremely welcoming and I feel like the best thing about Cincinnati is that it's not too big of a city but it has everything that I feel like a big city would offer it has your major sports teams it has these crazy events like blink which is where they light up the all of downtown they have awesome events like like October Fest they have an amazing zoo here um so they just have a wide variety of different entertainment for you know all kinds of people so yeah the city has been great as far as the move uh it did take a while not a while but maybe like one or two weeks to adjust because you know I was starting from scratch I never thought that I would leave Texas um and then just coming here with no real support system not really knowing anyone here um it took a little bit of time to adjust but I think I I adjusted pretty quickly um the people at the hospital are extremely open and easy to get along with so um they've become my main support system so again I'm I'm really extremely blessed to have such a such a great um you know Pierce in the hospital with me so that's really helped the move and helped me adjust a little bit quicker yeah absolutely and and I think um definitely being in Ohio you have that Midwestern Hospitality so I totally understand what you're saying when it comes to peers in the hospital being welcoming and kind of just that that Midwestern charm is definitely there so thank you for sharing that um and you know this is a this is a question that I love to end all of my episodes on so every guest no matter what other questions I've asked I will ask this one um looking back on the fellowship cycle and just the journey how competitive it was um you know if you could give your younger self or if you could get give another fellow advice on managing and having a successful cycle um and Landing a fellowship what would that be what is your advice yeah I would say the main thing would be don't put too much pressure on yourself I think um everything will play out the way it's supposed to be as long as you put your best foot forward and just know that you put in your best effort into those applications into making those relationships to ask for who you want uh to write a good recommendation letter for you doing well in school um you know to have competitive grades and things like that and to do good in your internship before you apply uh you know for a fellowship um I think as long as you that you do those things and really just put your best foot forward with the applications once the interviews come along just not to put too much pressure on yourself I still remember with some of my first round interviews uh were you know just was overthinking the the questions a little bit too much and it didn't going out uh working out in my favor and with those interviews where I was told myself to just be a little bit more relaxed a little bit more free I ended up doing a lot better so I think that's the the best piece of advice that I can offer as someone who has gone through that process yeah absolutely no great advice and you know um the two things that I will call out in what you just said um because well the first piece of advice that you gave I don't think anyone has given um on any of my episodes and I really want want to call it out you know you said do well in your internship I wish I could like put that on a t-shirt or on poster boards because I think this is something I have also constantly said right like doing well on your internship will give you talking points and experiences to elaborate during your fellowship interviews and I think people sometimes get too too into the fellowship cycle while they're doing their internship and they don't um invest time and they don't really learn anything during their internship and so I just want to thank you for bringing that kind of to light because whatever you achieve during your internship will be what what will help you be successful during your fellowship interviews um so thank you for that uh and the second thing that I I think you said that I always also say and a lot of my other guests have highlighted is not putting too much pressure on yourself I think there's a lot of ups and downs during the fellowship cycle and so giving yourself Grace and and just understanding that this is the process and the process will play out and I think trusting the process is very very important so thank you for for that incredible advice of course no thank you rangi yeah it's you know the like you said the internship goes it gets a little bit underrated but I definitely utilized a lot of the experience and the talking points and all my interviews so was thankful to have a great internship experience for sure yeah no it definitely sounds like it and kind of the last thing I'll say before closing out the episode is I also want to highlight something that maybe the listeners didn't catch but I did um it's the fact that you said that you know you pivoted into mha after kind of almost having a different career or going down a different route um and so that's another point of encouragement right like uh I think people may be discouraged by the fact that they had maybe a non-health management major in undergrad and that may discourage them from applying or going towards the mha route but a lot of people can pivot careers and find their way to an mha so I appreciate and I want to call that out because it's it's a unique part of your journey so thank you for highlighting that as well and you know this episode has been so great it's been incredible listening to your journey and also all the advice that you're giving our listener so I want to thank you for your time this evening and just again appreciate all the valuable advice you've given tonight no I want to thank you uh so much rangi for having me um it really means a lot I think you uh you know the podcast that you're doing is amazing the questions were all amazing so thank you for coordinating this it was extremely seamless and um you made it an extremely fun and enjoyable experience so thank you so much for having me</p>
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